A. No, sir. When I came with Strobel, I heard from Halifax that we could not be engaged because we did not do anything in getting men. Q. What do you mean by that?

A. That we did not raise plenty of men, and squandered all the money, as they said.

William Eckert, sworn.

This witness did not speak English, and was interpreted by Mr. Oehlschlager. Examined by Mr. Van Dyke.

Q. Can you write?

A. No, sir; I can read my name; I knew Mr. Hertz; I saw him at No. 68 South Third street.

Q. What did you go there for?

A. I went to enlist; I wanted to enlist in the British army.
Q. Did you enlist?

A. I did not enlist; I went down with a good friend of mine, whom I requested to bring me down; he did not go down with me, but suggested to me another who went down with me; my friend spoke for me, and said, "Here is a man who wishes to enter the British army.

Q. Who did he say that to?

A. Mr. Bosschart and Mr. Budd. One of the gentlemen answered, "We do not busy ourselves with it; we will merely send you to Halifax, and then if you wish to serve you can serve, and if you wish to work you can work:" that the men were enlisted in Halifax. My friend asked how much bounty money in hand was received, and Mr. Budd told him he would receive as bounty $30, and $8 a month. Well, then I asked whether there was nothing paid in advance or immediately, for the few days I would have to remain here. They said they gave nothing; then I went away. They asked me what my name was; I did not write it; Mr. Bosschart wrote it.

Q. Where did he write it?

A. On a sheet of paper.

Q. Did you agree to go?

Q. When was it he gave it to you-the day you sailed, or before? A. On Wednesday afternoon.

Q. Did you engage to go with the intention of enlisting when you got there?

Mr. Remak objected to the question as a leading one.

Judge Kane. The question is too directly indicative of its answer. Mr. Van Dyke. What was it your intention to do when you got to Halifax?

Question by Mr. Van Dyke. In what capacity did you want to go to the Crimea ?

A. As a soldier.

Q. When Mr. Hertz gave you the ticket to go to New York, did he understand that it was your intention to enlist when you arrived at Halifax?

Mr. Remak objected.

Q. Did Mr. Hertz, at the time he gave you a ticket to go to New York, know that it was your intention to go to Halifax?

Mr. Remak objected. The objection was overruled.

A. Mr. Hertz was not there the first day.

Q. I refer to the time he gave you the ticket; at the time Mr. Hertz gave you the ticket to go to New York, did he know it was your intention to enlist when you arrived at Halifax?

A. Mr. Hertz was not there when my friend brought me to the office.

Q. You have said that Mr. Hertz gave you a ticket to go to New York?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. At the time Mr. Hertz gave you this ticket to go to New York, did he know it was your intention to enlist?

A. I do not know whether the other gentleman told me the reason why he wished me to go to New York.

Q. Had you told Mr. Budd your intention?

Mr. Remak objected. The objection was overruled.

A. He heard it.

Q. On Monday?

A. Yes, sir.

The counsel for the defence, (Mr. Remak,) in the course of the examination of this witness, frequently interrupted, and attempted to correct the interpreter in his interpretation of the language of the witness. On the conclusion of the examination, he called Mr. Oehlschlager to the stand, for the purpose of questioning him as to his interpretation of the witness, but on after-consideration waived the examination.

Augustus Titus, sworn. Examined by Mr. Van Dyke.

Q. Do you know Mr. Hertz?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. Which is the person?

Witness (pointing to Hertz.) That is the gentleman sitting there. Q. State what you know of this matter?

A. Well, I was here in the city without work, and I had no boarding house to go to, as my landlady had told me to leave; so I read of this place in the Ledger, and went down and saw Mr. Budd there, and a couple of other gentlemen; I went in and asked them if this was the place where they enlisted them, and I was told

Q. Who did you ask that?

A. The gentleman is not here-he was a stranger to me. Mr. Hertz was not there the first time.

Q. How long was this before you sailed?

A. It was about 3 o'clock in the afternoon of day before. Then I

was told that I could not see the agent now, that he was out, and to come in two hours after that time. I came in, and I saw Mr. Budd, and he asked me my name; and I told him my name, and he wrote it down on a sheet of paper.

Judge Kane. How came he to ask your name?

A. Well, I don't know, without he wanted to put it down.

Q. Did you tell him what you wanted?

A. I asked him if this was the place where they enlisted, and he said no, it was not the place where they enlisted, but the place where they got men to take them to Halifax.

Q. For what purpose?

A. For enlisting. I gave them my name.

My intention was only

to go to New York. I was going to New York, and there I was going to leave them.

Q. Did you tell them that was your intention?

A. No, sir, I did not; I kept that to myself.

Q. You were going to out-wit them then, I suppose?

A. Well, I was going to try to; I did not know whether I would succeed.

Q. What did you tell them you intended to do?

A. I told them I intended to go out to Halifax for the purpose of enlisting.

Q. When did you see Hertz?

I

A. On the morning we sailed I saw him; I went up to the office and asked him what boat I was to go on, and he said that he would be down and make arrangements. There were Mr. Hertz, Mr. Budd, Mr. Bosschart, and another gentleman standing talking together, and I went down to the boat and waited until Mr. Hertz came down. cannot say whether he came with Budd or not. I stopped down at the boat, and before we started Mr. Budd went around the wharf to see whether any one else was off the boat, and when he found there was none there, he came on board, and just before we commenced to start he called us all up. He did not form us into a rank. Sometimes he came to us one by one, and sometimes two or three were collected together, and he would ask our names. We told him our names, and he marked a cross, I think. I won't say it was a cross; it was a mark of his own on the paper. At that time we went down to the navy yard, when Marshal Wynkoop caught us. [Laughter.]

Q. Did you get a ticket?

A. Yes, sir, I got a ticket of Mr. Budd, at 68 South Third street. Mr. Hertz was not there at the time. I can read.

Q. (Ticket shown.) Is that the ticket?

A. That is the color of the card (green) I got. On the back was "Pine St. Wharf," and those are the letters (N. S. R. C.") I have had them in my head from that day to this, and ever will remember them.

Judge Kane. Perhaps you can tell us what those letters mean? A. No, sir, I cannot. They stand for something I am not able to tell.

Q. You say you can read. (Paper shown.) Is that the paper he marked your name on?

A. Well, I cannot say whether it was a whole sheet or half sheet. He had it lying on a table.

Q. Well, your name is on that sheet?

A. Yes, sir, my name is on there, No. 9.

Mr. Van Dyke. Is there any cross examination ?

Mr. Cuyler. There is a frankness about this witness that quite disarms cross-examination.

Charles Weaver, sworn.

Examined by Mr. Van Dyke.

Q. Do you know Mr. Hertz?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. Can you point him out here?

A. (Pointing to Hertz.) That is the gentleman.

Q. Did you see him in March, 1855?

A. Yes, sir, down in Third street.

Q. What did you go there for?

A. I went down because I heard from some of my friends that they were enlisting soldiers for the British army there. I went down-it was an hour before they started-and I asked him whether he enlisted men to go into the British army; he said no, I do not enlist, but if you want to be enlisted I will give you a ticket to New York, and from there the officer would give me a ticket to Halifax.

Q. Did you tell him you would enlist in Halifax?

A. No, sir, I did not tell him that; I told him I wanted to enlist, and he gave me a ticket; he did not give me any money; he took my

name.

Q. Was it written in a book, or on paper?

A. I suppose it was written on a sheet of paper; Mr. Hertz took my name-he wrote it.

Q. Did you go on board the boat?

A. Yes, sir.

Q. (Ticket shown.) Was it one of these tickets that you had? A. Yes, sir, I had one of that kind; I went down to Pine street wharf; Mr. Hertz was there the day the boat sailed; I went down with a friend of mine to the boat; I saw this man, Mr. Bosschart, there, and he said, this is the boat that goes to New York; Mr. Budd was on the boat-he was in command; he took my name on board the boat, and called us together the same as an officer; there were twelve or thirteen men together, and he had command of them; that is what I saw; he took the names on the list, and as he took them he called us together, and told us to go on that side or this; he mustered us into rank.

Mr. Cuyler. What do you understand by mustering into rank? A. Well, we stood in a line, and he said, fall in.

Q. Who told you that?

A. This young gentleman, (pointing to Budd.)
Q. That is not Mr. Hertz?

A. No, sir.

Q. Who is it?

A. Mr. Budd; that is the gentleman,

Patrick Conroy, sworn. Examined by Mr. Van Dyke.

Q. You have been examined before in this case?

A. Yes, sir, before the commissioner.

Q. State to the court and jury what you know in this matter, and what you have heard from either of these defendants, Hertz or Perkins?

A. I never saw Hertz but at the United States commissioner's office; I had the conversation about this matter with Mr. Perkins.

Q. State when you had that conversation, and what it was? A. Well, I was introduced to Mr. Perkins at the Pennsylvanian office. Is it necessary for me to state all of this matter?

Mr. Van Dyke. If it relates to the issue now on trial, state all. Witness. I was introduced to Mr. Perkins at the Pennsylvanian office, some time last December-I suppose in that neighborhood; and a few days afterwards I had a conversation with him at Mr. McGeoy's Hotel, in Walnut street, in which he said there were things he might wish to talk to me about; I did not understand it at the time, and not knowing what he meant, I did not say anything. The next time I met him was at the Pennsylvanian office again; he was about leaving it in the evening, and was cursing and ready to kill all about the office, damning everybody in the office; I asked him what was the matter, and he took me by the arm, and we walked down a little; he said that he had just been writing a letter to one of the lords in England, who had charge of the government there; that he had everything right with the Pennsylvanian newspaper here, so far as siding with the government against Russia was concerned; and the first thing he saw that morning was an article directly against what he had written to England, and that the Pennsylvanian had deceived him. I passed it off carelessly, as I did not care what was going on between him and the Pennsylvanian or the British government. I met him again some time afterwards in the Exchange Hotel, and he called me to one side, and told me that it was necessary to raise a certain amount of men in this country for the purpose of raising a legion to go to the Crimea. I asked him how it was, and he said that such was the case. I asked him if there was any danger in enlisting men in this country for that purpose, for I had heard that there was, and he said no-that he had been down to Washington, and fixed all that. He said that Mr. Crampton sent for him, and when he went to Crampton he sent him to Marcy; and when Marcy asked him all about it, he said he humbugged him about it, and told him that he was only going to send the men to Halifax to dig a canal; that Mr. Marcy, in reply, remarked that he was a pretty cunning fellow, and then it all passed over; it was all fixed, and there was no more danger at all about it; he then said to me that if I would choose to take a part in the matter, he could guaranty me a commission in the legion for a certain number of men, and for a less number he could guaranty a non-commission; that if I would take an interest in the matter he would fix things for me, but that it would take two or three months to do so; that I knew there were a great many men over the country who were suffering from bad times, and who could be enlisted, and that he would make it to my interest to do so. I told him I would