2. Must not the object or idea exist prior to the name or term by which it is designated? For example, the term "steam-boat," a word invented in our time-was not the object in existence before this name was found in our vocabulary?

3. Must not the idea of the existence of any particular object be prior to the idea of any of its properties? Or can we conceive of the properties of a thing, before we have an idea of that thing's existence ?

4. How, then, do we become conscious of the idea of spirit, our consciousness being limited to the objects of sensation, perception, and memory; and, consequently, all our mental operations being necessarily confined to the same objects?

5. Does not our belief, as well as our knowledge and experience, depend upon our mental operations?

I choose to present the matter in this form in order to elicit from my opponent something like an analysis of the powers of the human mind, which we must have, sooner or later, in this controversy, if either of us will redeem the pledge we have given to this community. [Half hour out.]

Here Mr. Owen rises and states that the period has expired for which they can be permitted to occupy the building this afternoon.

Tuesday forenoon, April 14th, 1829.

MR. OWEN risesGentlemen Moderators-You decided yesterday evening, that the part of the subject to be continued by me, was to prove that all religions have been founded in ignorance. It was, I believe, so stated by the Chairman.

I last night received some questions from my friend, Mr. Campbell; but discovering that they are not applicable to the subject matter immediately before us, we will postpone the consideration of them until I have demonstrated the five propositions which I have engaged to prove. Afterwards, I will, if time permit, discuss any metaphysical question, however subtle. But, as you, gentlemen, have decided that we shall proceed to investigate the points agreed upon between Mr. Campbell and myself, I feel bound to abide by your decision.

My friends, I yesterday pursued this point through four of the fundamental laws, upon which I rely to prove all I have undertaken to do, in this engagement with Mr. Campbell. I will now proceed to the fifth, viz. "That each individual is so created at birth, that he may be compelled to receive true ideas or false notions, and beneficial or injurious habits, and retain them with great tenacity." This is one of the fundamental laws of human nature, which may properly be called a divine law no man created it: no man knows how it was created: it exists in man at all times, wherever he may be found it is beyond man's control; and I conceive that that which is beyond human control, to be truly divine, if any thing can be so called. If, then, it be a law of our nature, that infants may be so placed, that without the possibility of resistance on their parts, they may be compelled to receive rational ideas or false notions; they cannot be responsible for what they are thus made to receive, without their consent. When we look at the countenance of those who have been born and reared in

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very inferior circumstances of life-of those wholly devoid of education, we discover at once their ignorance before they speak. expression of their countenances assures us, before a word is spoken, that they are devoid of intelligence. We perceive that their training and instruction have been entirely neglected. Are these men to be responsible for the neglect which they have experienced? On the other hand, let us observe the countenances of intelligent, well educated men, and we shall be compelled to draw the conclusion, that they have been educated amidst circumstances comparatively favourable for the development of their mental faculties. But can these individuals deserve merit for being so placed? Surely man has always been in error on these subjects. The character of the varied circumstances in which they were placed from infancy, is stamped upon the expression and features of both. They were made what they are, by measures adopted by persons, over whom they had no control, and by a power of which they were ignorant.

My friends, whenever you shall consider these things, rationally, you will discover that not one of the religions which has ever been invented, or forced upon mankind, apply to a being who is thus organized. Fortunately for our posterity, we have now discovered that we are so created, that the adults of this or any subsequent generation may form the character of their successors, to attain high physical and mental excellence; and, through this knowledge, we shall soon learn to do justice to human nature. We shall not continue as we have heretofore done, to find fault with human nature, because our parents have allowed us to be trained in all kinds of ignorance and bad feeling. No: we shall discover that we are the effects of causes, as certain and known, as any effects that ever man traced up to the known and ascertained causes.

When we shall learn to know ourselves; when we shall no longer remain in ignorance of what manner of beings we are; then, and then only, shall we know how to estimate the value and importance of a human being at birth: they will be no longer neglected in infancy. We shall be conscious of the necessity which exists, to give the greatest attention to the formation of their ideas, habits, and characters, from the commencement of their existence. Then we shall discover the certain method whereby to make our infants the most superior of human beings-superior in ideas, in habits, in manners, in disposition, and in morals-superior in every thing calculated to improve the condition of society. If, however, these new arrangements were now in the full tide of successful experiment; if they were now even actually consummated, and their happy effects experienced; I would not conscientiously attribute one particle of praise or blame to the individuals who had been the most prominent agents in bringing about such a revolution. No, my friends, we might, with equal justice, attribute merit to the coat which I now wear, because it is black, as to the individual to whose lot it may fall to bring about this new order of things. We can paint any infant black or white, in character, by our care or neglect; but who shall blame or praise the infant for what others perform for him, and not err? No: when once the full truth

upon this subject shall be understood and appreciated, all irrational praise and blame, all those unkind feelings which the present system generates, will no longer exist; there will not be a single motive for a harsh feeling amongst the whole race. Why, my friends, we have been told (and that truly, too,) that the greatest of all virtues is charity. But what kind of charity? Is it a charity for those who happen to be placed in like circumstances with ourselves? Is it a charity for our own particular sect or party? No: the character which is required to form this virtue, can be derived only from this knowledge of ourselves, and through this knowledge it will become irresistible and universal; it will be a pure unalloyed charity, extending to the whole human race. Compare now this charity, which excludes not one human being that ever has been born, with the charity which now exists in the world. And why has not this charity been coeval with our race? Why? simply because from the beginning of time we have been kept in the dark; because, all manner of foul play has been employed to make and to keep us irrational, and to prevent us from knowing any thing about ourselves.

Whenever a spirit more ardent than that belonging to the ordinary race of mortals attempted an investigation of moral and social diseases, there has ever been a government and a priesthood at hand to say to them in a voice of thunder, "Trespass not upon our prerogatives; advance not one step in that direction without our permission; know you not that the people must be kept in the dark?" But, my friends, how beautiful are the simple truths of nature! They require no preaching, sunday after sunday, year after year, generation after generation, to prove that they are true. A half-dozen sermons upon religion and morals would be quite sufficient to enlighten all who might hear them. This plan of proceeding would certainly save a great expense of time and money, and be a great gain, in many important points of view, to the public. But do not suppose that I wish to excite one angry feeling against the priesthood. They are a class, formed like all other classes, by the circumstances of the societies in which they live, and are no more culpable than any other portion of any other society. I have several friends, whom I highly esteem, who are ministers, not of one but of all the sects generally known in Europe-men whom I believe to be strictly conscientious; and, with some of these in particular, I live on terms of great intimacy, and feel a great regard and affection for them personally. I have two brothers-in-law who are Christian ministers, and we have always had a sincere friendship for each other. I cannot blame them or other ministers of religion for being made what they are. I feel the injustice of attributing to any of them individually the errors of their sects, or the evils which they create. The responsibility which I have assumed in my continued earnest endeavours to subvert all the religions of the world, and thereby deprive many individuals of their present only mode of support, has been always one of serious consideration. It has occupied much of my thoughts. I have been most anxious to discover a safe and secure mode to prevent priests, lawyers,

physicians, or merchants being injured personally by the change, in mind, body, or estate. I know that the time has now arrived when this change (tremendous as it may and must appear to those who are not prepared for it) must take place; and take place too, rapidly, my friends, unless we can beforehand infuse so much charity as to prompt us to the adoption of the means by which the present individuals in these classes may be supported as long as they live. But I am not without consolation even upon this subject. The peculiar circumstances in which I have been placed, (circumstances which I may hereafter explain if necessary,) enable me to state confidently that the time has passed when it is necessary to have any contest about the means of living in comfort, or about any pecuniary consideration. The enormous scientific power obtained within the last half century for the creation of wealth, with the increase of knowledge, upon many other important subjects, will change men's minds on these matters, and introduce a principle of justice instead of the practice of gain. The public may be expected to become rational upon these subjects, and be enabled to guide these two powers to produce a general benefit for all classes. When these powers are developed, they will be found amply sufficient to secure to every child, from birth to death, a full supply of every thing really beneficial for his nature, or that can contribute to his happiness. As we advance in real knowledge, and thus become rational, we shall discover that there can be no cause for anxiety, with regard to pecuniary matters, or rather the means of living in comfort. We shall perceive that, with the ample means now possessed by society, arrangements the most simple and beautiful may be created to produce a superfluity of real wealth for the whole society, so abundant, indeed, that we may all freely use as much as we desire-even then, there will be a surplus, greatly exceeding the wants on all.

My friends, do not suppose that these are chimerical notions, unwarranted by fact. They may be easily explained and demonstrated to be truths, by facts the most valuable to mankind, and capable, when rightly applied, to make the most happy results for the generations to come. This beneficial change is as certain to arrive, through the necessary progress of improvement and advance of knowledge, as that you now hear the sound of my voice. These must be the necessary results of this law of our nature, when understood and acted upon in connexion with the other laws; and I think Mr. Campbell has admitted the accuracy of them all, except the one that declares our wills to have no power to change our convictions, or to force any belief on our minds, contrary to the strongest conviction already made upon them. But, my friends, this law of our nature promulgates a self-evident truth. If men are thus plastic, in childhood, shall we not adopt the same method of moulding them into beings who shall be virtuous, and consequently happy themselves, and dispensers of happiness to others? Why, with a knowledge of this law, shall one inferior human being be hereafter formed? There is surely no necessity for it; not even that one discordant disposition should be formed to

mar the general happiness. My friends, do you not already perceive how much we should all be benefited, if there were no inferior characters amongst us?

We come now to the 6th fundamental principle of human nature which my friend, Mr. Campbell, says he is not quite willing to subscribe to. Now, my friends, I should be very sorry to leave any thing even doubtful or unsettled, either in your minds or my friend Mr. Campbell's. To establish the truth of this divine law of our nature, it is only necessary to adduce facts which every one can comprehend, and must assent to.

Therefore, I trust, that before we separate, not only my friend Mr. Campbell, but every reflecting person here will admit the truth of this law. This 6th law then (which appears to be the present stumbling block) is, "that each individual is so created, that he must believe according to the strongest impressions made upon his feelings and faculties, and that his belief in no case depends upon his will." If the human race had not been involved in ignorance the most gross, and if that ignorance had not been continued up to the present hour, no one could have imagined for a moment that he had the power of belief or disbelief at his control.

We are beings so formed by nature, that we are compelled, often strongly against our wills, to believe what we do not desire to believe; to be convinced of that which we have not any inclination to believe, and what we never expect to believe. If any of you now suppose that you have the power to believe or disbelieve, according to your volitions, be so good as to believe, for a few moments, that I am not here;-can any of you do this? But it may be said, that this is a fact, so clear, that we cannot disbelieve it against the evidences of our senses. Well, then, will you have the goodness to control your wills, to believe full and unreservedly that Mohammed was a true prophet sent of God? Now, is there an individual here, who has been able so far to influence his will, as to believe in the divinity of Mohammed's mission? I know that this is impossible. And so it is, my friends, in all the other departments of human belief and opinions. Whenever the human mind shall be rescued from the thick darkness which has heretofore enveloped it, no proposition will be more self-evident, than that our will has no control over our belief and opinions. Whether born in China or Hindostan; amongst christians or Jews; whether in India or in Africa; all men are coerced by this and other laws of our nature, to believe according to the strongest impressions which the circumstances of birth, nurture, and education, have forced upon them. And, my friends, are you aware that this error, taught us from infancy, that our will has power over our belief, is the main pillar of all religions? They have, indeed, no other foundation; and you perceive it is quicksand only. Be assured there never has been a more injurious idea forced into the human mind, than that which has forced it to believe that there is merit or demerit in any opinion whatsoever. We can give to all children true ideas or false notions; for, in this respect, they are perfectly passive. And, indeed, in the universal igno